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Post by Chris on May 20, 2006 22:08:50 GMT -8
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Post by Rodney L. Voumard on May 21, 2006 4:50:43 GMT -8
Chris,
Some great POSTS about this issue. I know that BLUE doe's his best, and sense I do not call games... who am I to complain.
I have two concerns :
* The call mush be correct--in this case, sounds like BLUE was NOT CORRECT.
* Our UMPS must have some responsibility, like our VOLUNTEER MANAGERS to teach the game.
What I saw last night in taking away a 10 year olds first HR was terrible.
MY TWO CENTS
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Post by Greenie on May 21, 2006 9:13:43 GMT -8
Thanks Chris.. Patricks still is pretty upset about this. The way he is hitting right now it wont be long until he gets another one. I didn't see the bat being thrown as I was having a Heart Attack watching the ball fly over the fence..
I have never seen him throw a bat during any game so I have a hard time believing he did it. According to him he struck the catcher on his follow through and that knocked the bat out of his hands. A couple of people have told me the catcher had moved up close to the batter when he had 2 strikes on him and gave him no room to complete his swing. I dont know if this is what happened or not. The thing that is really bothering him the most is not seeing his name on the HR page ( must be an ego thing)LOL
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Post by Chris on May 21, 2006 9:24:45 GMT -8
Patrick's version makes perfect sense. In which case had he not knocked the ball out of the park, catcher interference should have been called and he would have been awarded first base. It's ashame and I feel for him. He got robbed by any interpretation of the rules. He'll definately get some more the way he's hitting perhaps in the all star tourney.
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the man who made the call
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Post by the man who made the call on May 21, 2006 14:06:34 GMT -8
Ok i know what the problem is. no one knows what really happened. the kid threw the bat not once not twice but three times. i being the ump warned this same kid twice. the third time i called the kid out. i had no idea the ball was going to go over the fence! it wouldnt have mattered. i warned the kid twice when i only need to warn once. i should hav ejected the kid for safty issues, but being nice and having only warned for an out and not ejection i call the kid out.
the catcher did not move up on the batter! the batter did not hit the catchers glove! what happened was simply the kid threw the bat a third time and nailed the catcher! although not intentional i had to call it on the batter. i should have ejected the kid also because of safty. if anyone has any questions bring them to me! i have talked to several other long time umpires and they all said i made the right call, but should have also ejected the batter! with that said i hope everyone understands.
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Post by Greenie on May 21, 2006 14:45:39 GMT -8
I debated long and hard (5 min) if I was going to respond to this post but here we go.
#1. Pat said the coach told him after his first at bat the ump said to watch throwing his bat that was it. You never said a word to my son. #2. Being's your'e a nice guy you make up rules as you please? There is nothing in the rulebook against throwing a bat. So you play Mr. NICE GUY until he hits a HOMERUN and then make up your own rule to call him out. I could understand you ejecting him for safety issues but you didn't. #3. I never said he hit the catchers glove. He hit the catcher on his follow through. #4. He has been playing ball for a few years now and not once has anyone warned him about throwing his bat now you say he did it 3 times in 1 game, give me a break. #5. Seem like even your long time umps need to learn the rules so this doesn't happen again. #6. About you being an ump... I better not go there as I realize you are out here VOLUNTEERING...
I think I better stop now before I get myself in trouble.
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Post by Chris on May 21, 2006 15:47:04 GMT -8
Blue ~
The long term umps are wrong based on 9.01. They are simply wrong. As I said last night, you gotta score the homer and the run.
You should know I have a great deal of respect for the way you manage the game as an umpire. You keep things under control and I believe you are totally impartial. You blew this one but hey I've blown many calls myself.
Your still a valuable asset to the league and shouldn't be too hard on yourself. It comes with the territory.
BTW - I hope you've visited the above link. I believe you'll find it very enlightening and may help you understand the concern.
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Post by Mark on May 21, 2006 17:04:43 GMT -8
Patrick's version makes perfect sense. In which case had he not knocked the ball out of the park, catcher interference should have been called and he would have been awarded first base. catchers interference is only when there is contact on the swing, not on the follow through swing. if there is contact with the catcher as the bat is going into or already in the K-Zone then it is catchers interference. but if if hits the catcher on the backswing there is no interference
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Post by Chris on May 21, 2006 18:04:46 GMT -8
I missed the backswing part but yes I'm aware that CI doesn't include the backswing. It may account for some confusion regarding whether the bat was thrown.
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the man who made the call
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Post by the man who made the call on May 21, 2006 18:04:59 GMT -8
i will only tell u once! if the umpire gets no appeal with proof then the ump interprets the call. i should have thrown the kid out for safety, but thats not what i warned for, i warned for an out and thats what was got. if you do not understand i cannot help you. i feel everyone is just to emotional over the call. the rule are simple, if there is no rule then the umpire interprets the call thats what i did get OVER IT!!!!!
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Post by Angela Moreno on May 21, 2006 18:05:16 GMT -8
I really think you guys need to talk this over man to man with David Day instead of picking on my son. Grow up guys! Stop acting as though you are in grade school cause your not. You are supposed to be setting an example not causing more problems your kids.
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Post by Chris on May 21, 2006 18:11:16 GMT -8
LOL - This isn't about you personally this is about the rule interpretation as you can see if you visited the rules link I posted. It's a complicated situation and many very experienced umpires disagree on certain aspects of the rule. This forum is for discussion purposes and we'll continue to discuss things in a respectful manner. You'll notice no names were used. If you have a problem with the forum don't visit here and save yourself the frustration....DONT PERSONALIZE IT!
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Post by Angela Moreno on May 21, 2006 18:17:54 GMT -8
:)I just want parents to behave themselves and not take things sor serisously - its only a game there is not need to play with their kids emotions that way...it's just not healthy for anyone.
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the man who made the call
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Post by the man who made the call on May 21, 2006 18:20:48 GMT -8
9.01 states like i said i can interpret the call if there is no specific ruling. thats what i did. i stand by my call and thats that. for you that think im only vounteer that will change over june 18 through june 24. then once certified i want to see what kind of respect you treat an UMPIRE with! i cant believe to grown men are goin to argue a call which they themselves didnt see, and dont know for sure what should be done. GET OVER IT! other "volunteers" as you up it will let things slide because the dont understand fully what they are doing or just dont want to be mean. well i know the game, and im willing to bet more than the two men im arguing with. so like i said you come talk to me and i'll be happy to tell you as it is!
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Post by Chris on May 21, 2006 18:22:53 GMT -8
I respectfully disagree. Don't you think this is a far better way to discuss things than doing it at the ball park? The same thing went on when Jerry tossed a kid for throwing a bat. I think this venue is a very healthy way to vent. It appeared to help with a tense situation on the Amercan side.
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